2nd Generation This includes all Eclipses, and Talons built from 1995-1999

Knife-edged crank

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #11  
Old 08-09-2007, 09:21 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

If I'm correct, the quote basically states that the crank is up high above the sump level and the crank has squirters to oil them
So a crank scraper may help with down low and may remove some frothing and bubbling, but what about the squirters above the scraper?

 
  #12  
Old 08-10-2007, 12:20 AM
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,026
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

the squirters help lubricate the wrist pin and cylinder walls, and help cool the pistons from the excessive heat of turbocharging a little motor.
the oil pump is what lubes the main / rod bearings - do i need to explain in detail of how it works?

a crank scraper really cuts the windage cloud down to nothing by - one blocking the air/oil cloud spinning around the crank, and 2 - scraping the oil off the crank (and stopping it in the cloud)and putting it back in the pan where it needs to return to. when you have a windage cloud you get aeriation and aeriation leads to insufficient lubrication of parts and...


[IMG]local://upfiles/10240/D5CAE3C826B043BDBBBFA838D1035C09.jpg[/IMG]
 
  #13  
Old 08-10-2007, 01:48 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

I just don't see how this crankscraper on a 4g63 is going to do much of anything...



[IMG]local://upfiles/10268/6974C002FE3B47428F8292CD83417BA8.jpg[/IMG]
 
  #14  
Old 08-10-2007, 01:53 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

It's not even close tolerance. It's far from it.
That's what $74-$79 will buy you from Crank-Scrapers.
What's the HP gain from this?
A windage tray would do more than a scraper IMO.
 
  #15  
Old 08-10-2007, 02:03 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

Look at the close tolerance in this Honda motor..
http://www.crank-scrapers.com/a20_tef_e.jpg
That one does something.
Don't our motors already have windage trays?



**
Compare the scraper from the 4g63 and the Porsche 944's scraper..


Look how close that clearance is...now, that is a scraper that does some good.
Otherwise, it's just a piece of extra metal in the block. **
 
  #16  
Old 08-10-2007, 03:21 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

If anything knife-edge the crank, airfoil style. FFWD does that too, including the knifing. They don't "point" the trailing edge either, they "point" the leading edge, just like an airplane's wing. The other way was to "point" the trailing edge over the leading edge. The idea was that the trailing edge will "cut" through the oil since some cranks actually do dip into the oil sump. Our cranks don't, but like Racer was saying is that the dripping oil from the squirters do come back down and bounce off the crank or stick to it, only to get flung around. That's where the airfoil or the knifing comes into play.
http://www.ffwdconnection.com/butchercrank.shtml

To knife or not to knife...do you NEED it? I don't know. Ask yourself this. Does your motor rev high enough to do this supporting mod? Do you have aftermarket valve springs to keep from happily overrevving your motor because of the lightened crank?
Crankscrapers...the one that's made for our motors are a joke. The ones for 420As are very beneficial because they don't have a windage tray at all. The one made at Crank-Scrapers has a windage tray/scraper. That Neon motor needs it. Chad, you of all people should know that

 
  #17  
Old 08-10-2007, 03:49 AM
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,026
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

damn i need that for my neon.....
if a crank scraper is not close in tolerance than its useless, but if you look at that pic way up there it would be close to the counterbalance once you spun it around.
people argue that oil wont be on the crank when its revved high, but you gotta remember how the oil gets in the bearings, it goes through the block in holes into the main bearings, then through holes in the crank to the rods and is flung out the sides of the bearings between the crank and main / rod journals.
you might not make more power on a dyno with one but extended high RPM and hard cornering create alot different situation than a dyno, evryone forgets a dyno is a "controlled" environment with no G forces in any direction to slosh the oil in the pan, a hard corner is enough to move the oil to one side forcing it up around the crank. - Thats where you get the worst case of oil wrapping around , plus with it being to one side of the pan then you have the chance of the sump drawing in air, then you really got a mess.
Now on the note of a Chevy V8 the crank needs to fling oil out because thats the only way the camshaft gets lubricated is the spray off the crank,andthe return holes in the lifter valley drip on the lobes.
but even with a crank scraper theres enough from the return holes in the head and lifter valley that can get flung back up - thats the reason a V8 has a special cam break-in - 1800-3000 RPM constantly varying for 10-15 minutes (unless its a roller cam)
my post is getting too long.... lol
 
  #18  
Old 08-10-2007, 03:53 AM
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,026
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

This feels more like a presidential debate silver, lol
vote for me...
 
  #19  
Old 08-10-2007, 04:47 AM
silvercoupe97's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Posts: 3,430
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

ORIGINAL: racerx55

This feels more like a presidential debate silver, lol
vote for me...
Lol...no, vote for me

Dude, I don't think anyones posts can get as long as mine at times, lol. I just can't stop typing sometimes.

I have to say though. One thing that the crank scraper can do for the 4g63 is "catch" the falling oil and stop it from flying around more. Even if it only catches half the amount, I think that would be significant enough. I really don't think that it's all that needed though since there's a windage tray. An actual tray as opposed to a windage screen.
You're right though. A dyno is for numbers and track tuning, IMO. That's why I haven't gone to our 1 AWD dyno. That's no way to tune for the streets. You street tune a car on the street and track tune a car on a dyno, albeit not an easy task. That's just me though. Anywho...
If going through the twisties affects oil pumping, I would forget all this mumbo jumbo and go with a dry sump. That would benefit the 4g63 over a scraper that doesn't even look to be .15. It looks more like a 1/4", lol. The 420a item looks very promising. It actually does something X2, lol.
 
  #20  
Old 08-10-2007, 07:01 AM
RCJr9186's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Summerville, SC
Posts: 5,650
Default RE: Knife-edged crank

egh... sick of reading lol this is like the debate between if the EGR block off plate actuall does anything or not.... you can fight allllll day long on if it does or doesn't do anything but at the end of they day it's doesn't hlep you enough to be worth of typing this much.
 


Quick Reply: Knife-edged crank



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:45 AM.