Worn driver's flange cause Montero's to roll in park?
Hopefully someone can point me in the right direction and sorry for the long post. Just wanted to provide as much information as I could as I'm not readily available if someone posts with a question. I'm no expert but I am stumped as I can not find anyone specifically pointing out this issue.
My main question:2002 Montero Sport Limited (AWD)
My front right drivers flange splines are worn and the splines on the end of the CV-Axle are worn as well. Would worn splines in this area allow a vehicle to still be able to roll while its in park? I figured being AWD that if something in this area broke it still shouldn't be able to roll while in park. Am I wrong or is this the way all Limited AWD are, or it it something worse and more internal? I've searched and searched and have come up with nothing. Will replacing the drive flange and cv-axle solve this issue?
Background of the issue:
Issue was first noticed when wife went to work and after getting there putting the vehicle in park. While in park the vehicle started rolling. When she called me my first thought was parking pawl. Asked how everything else was and she said it was shifting fine, no noises, nothing unusual going on other than rolling in park. No check engine light on, nothing. I thought no biggie so told her to just pull up the e brake whenever she needed to park until I got around to it or took it in. After a few more drives it started making a very light, no binding, metal to metal clunking noise. Thought maybe the that pawl came off (or possible U-Joint) and was rattling around so I told her to park it and not drive it until it's looked at.
This past weekend I put all 4 tires up in the air (AWD I'm thinking that's a good place to start) and started spinning each tire to check drive train areas to see if I could pinpoint anything loose or where the noise was coming from. Once I got to the front right (passenger) the tire spun and seemed not to be connected to the cv-axle (drivers side still spun the CV-axle). Axle wasn't loose or coming out, nothing seem to be broken, boots still in decent shape (no missing clips or tears). So I started to tear into the front right. Once the tire was off I was able to rotate the hub area and feel a little catch (figured that would be the light clicking sound). Took off the drive flange and seen snap ring was still seated. After inspection I put the drive flange on backwards as the other end had decent splines and it didn't slip at all by hand. That's were I am at now and I'm thinking that's it but I can not find any evidence that this failed area would still allow the vehicle to roll while being in park. Everything I have searched points to parking pawl? Transmission shops and dealership won't answer questions without seeing it. They want me to bring it in for diagnosis/estimate costs
My main question:2002 Montero Sport Limited (AWD)
My front right drivers flange splines are worn and the splines on the end of the CV-Axle are worn as well. Would worn splines in this area allow a vehicle to still be able to roll while its in park? I figured being AWD that if something in this area broke it still shouldn't be able to roll while in park. Am I wrong or is this the way all Limited AWD are, or it it something worse and more internal? I've searched and searched and have come up with nothing. Will replacing the drive flange and cv-axle solve this issue?
Background of the issue:
Issue was first noticed when wife went to work and after getting there putting the vehicle in park. While in park the vehicle started rolling. When she called me my first thought was parking pawl. Asked how everything else was and she said it was shifting fine, no noises, nothing unusual going on other than rolling in park. No check engine light on, nothing. I thought no biggie so told her to just pull up the e brake whenever she needed to park until I got around to it or took it in. After a few more drives it started making a very light, no binding, metal to metal clunking noise. Thought maybe the that pawl came off (or possible U-Joint) and was rattling around so I told her to park it and not drive it until it's looked at.
This past weekend I put all 4 tires up in the air (AWD I'm thinking that's a good place to start) and started spinning each tire to check drive train areas to see if I could pinpoint anything loose or where the noise was coming from. Once I got to the front right (passenger) the tire spun and seemed not to be connected to the cv-axle (drivers side still spun the CV-axle). Axle wasn't loose or coming out, nothing seem to be broken, boots still in decent shape (no missing clips or tears). So I started to tear into the front right. Once the tire was off I was able to rotate the hub area and feel a little catch (figured that would be the light clicking sound). Took off the drive flange and seen snap ring was still seated. After inspection I put the drive flange on backwards as the other end had decent splines and it didn't slip at all by hand. That's were I am at now and I'm thinking that's it but I can not find any evidence that this failed area would still allow the vehicle to roll while being in park. Everything I have searched points to parking pawl? Transmission shops and dealership won't answer questions without seeing it. They want me to bring it in for diagnosis/estimate costs
Good write up. Sorry I don't have any good advice - not really familiar with how the pawl is set up to work - but it sounds like it's not. Only thing I can add is that our trucks are not full-time AWD. The transfer case solenoid needs to engage in order for the front diff to be connected. And this would not be the case when parked with the key off.
EDIT - My mistake, the AWD solenoid is not in the transfer case - it's at the front diff, which is always connected to the trans. The AWD solenoid engages the front axle. And when it fails the car tries to go into AWD while moving and makes a horrible grinding noise. This happened to me and it's apparently a not uncommon failure. The vacuum actuator for this is on the right side of the axle IIRC but I'm not sure if that could have caused those splines to be ground off.
EDIT - My mistake, the AWD solenoid is not in the transfer case - it's at the front diff, which is always connected to the trans. The AWD solenoid engages the front axle. And when it fails the car tries to go into AWD while moving and makes a horrible grinding noise. This happened to me and it's apparently a not uncommon failure. The vacuum actuator for this is on the right side of the axle IIRC but I'm not sure if that could have caused those splines to be ground off.
Last edited by jrmdir; Oct 9, 2020 at 02:58 PM.
Good write up. Sorry I don't have any good advice - not really familiar with how the pawl is set up to work - but it sounds like it's not. Only thing I can add is that our trucks are not full-time AWD. The transfer case solenoid needs to engage in order for the front diff to be connected. And this would not be the case when parked with the key off.
EDIT - My mistake, the AWD solenoid is not in the transfer case - it's at the front diff, which is always connected to the trans. The AWD solenoid engages the front axle. And when it fails the car tries to go into AWD while moving and makes a horrible grinding noise. This happened to me and it's aapparently a not uncommon failure. The vacuum actuator for this is on the right side of the axle IIRC but I'm not sure if that could have caused those splines to be ground off.
EDIT - My mistake, the AWD solenoid is not in the transfer case - it's at the front diff, which is always connected to the trans. The AWD solenoid engages the front axle. And when it fails the car tries to go into AWD while moving and makes a horrible grinding noise. This happened to me and it's aapparently a not uncommon failure. The vacuum actuator for this is on the right side of the axle IIRC but I'm not sure if that could have caused those splines to be ground off.
Now I may be confused. When you say "sports limited" do you have a Montero Sport or a Montero Limited (full size)? They are different platforms and I have no knowledge of the Montero Sport drivetrain. But if we are talking about a Montero Limited, then there is nothing automatic about the switch to 4WD. No traction sensing etc. To get it into 4WD, you need to move the lever next to the main shift lever from 2wd to 4wd. That tells the solenoid to connect the front axle to the front diff and then all four wheels are in drive mode.
Last edited by jrmdir; Oct 10, 2020 at 07:04 AM.
Regardless of whether you have Montero Sport or full size Montero Limited, AWD system works the same. In "normal" AWD setting on Montero, all three differentials (front, back and middle i.e. transfer case) remain unlocked. This allows small amount of wheel speed difference between all 4 wheels and this permits driving on hard pavement. If one wheel looses traction, theoretically it can be permitted to turn freely, but I doubt that ever happens. There is enough resistance in drivetrain gearing that some power will be transferred to the other axle. Similarly, if you were to park on the incline with one wheel on solid ice, while 3 other are on hard pavement, Montero will not roll down the hill. I don't think your troubles with it rolling in park are related to stripped spines in front axle. Is it possible? Maybe. The only way to tell is to put it in 2WD and park at tbe same location. If it rolls - the problem is with parking pawl. If not, then you confirm stripped spline and AWD setting are causing it.
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